As It Should Be with Thamarrah Jones

By Thamarrah Jones

What if we centered equity and social justice in everything we do? On the As It Should Be podcast, Thamarrah Jones is sharing stories from every day people building an equitable future for all — as it should be.

This interview-style podcast is for people learning (and unlearning) their role in upholding systems that hurt people. What does it take to recreate the world as it should be? Well, it takes you. Ordinary people, doing what you can with the skills that you have to create more honest, compassionate, and intentional communities each day.

New episodes twice a month.

Listen on Spotify

Available on

Bittersweet Goodbye

As It Should Be with Thamarrah JonesAug 31, 2023

00:00

02:55

Bittersweet Goodbye

After 30 episodes, hundreds of my own dollars, and an uncountable amount of hours it's time to officially say goodbye to the As It Should Be with Thamarrah Jones podcast. But in the coming weeks I'll be sharing bits of my next project which you can follow along on by going to bylittle.substack.com

Until then my friends.

Aug 31, 202302:55

30: Change Narratives, Shift Society with Rinku Sen (she/her)

Rinku Sen joins Thamarrah to get into what it means to build narrative power and how changing dominant narratives can reshape society.

Rinku is the Executive director of Narrative Initiative an organization that engages in the work of deep narrative change by equipping social justice leaders with the knowledge, resources, and skills necessary to harness narrative power and create durable social change.

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Find more As It Should Be at asitshouldbepod.com

Support the show: Join the Collective for only $3 a month

Dec 14, 202241:43

29: Support Black Business with Melvin Graham (he/him)

Melvin Graham (he/him) is in conversation with Thamarrah about the unique challenges of Black owned businesses and the role Black entrepreneurship has played in building America.

Melvin is a filmmaker and director of the docuseries Black Business LA. In this series he follows entrepreneurs in the Los Angeles area building businesses despite a growing economic crisis.

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Find more As It Should Be at asitshouldbepod.com

Support the show: Join the Collective for only $3 a month

Nov 30, 202244:38

28: Support LGBTQ+ Youth with Elise Schuster (they/them)

What if we raised an entire generation of young people to live freely and authentically as themselves? This is the question that Elise and Thamarrah explore in today's episode.

Elise Schuster is a sexuality educator with 15 years of experience in youth development and sexual health education. They spent years teaching workshops and having thousands of one-on-one educational pleasure-based sexual health conversations before co-founding the nonprofit OkaySo. OkaySo is on a mission to help young people become comfortable with the most personal and vulnerable topics in their lives by connecting them with experienced experts with the aiming to help them live freely and authentically as who they truly are.

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Find more As It Should Be at asitshouldbepod.com

Support the show: Join the Collective for only $3 a month

Nov 17, 202256:10

27: Make Music Not Prisons with Fury Young (he/him) & BL Shirelle (she/her)

In today's episode Thamarrah (she/her) is joined by Fury Young & BL Shirelle to discuss how Die Jim Crow Records is dismantling stereotypes of incarceration impacted people through music.

Fury is DJC’s founder and Co-Executive Director and Under his leadership, Die Jim Crow Records has recorded over 60 incarcerated artists and over a dozen formerly incarcerated artists and gained access inside 5 different prisons.

BL Shirelle is and the Co-Executive Director of DJC and a phenomenal songwriter/rapper and producer on the label and a justice-impacted artist herself, raising up her community and sharing her art and activism with the world.

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Today's episode is brought to you by the Now We Know podcast.

Find more As It Should Be at asitshouldbepod.com

Support the show: Join the Collective for only $3 a month

Oct 21, 202244:60

26: Protect Your Family Online with Joe Miller, Esq. (he/him)

In today's episode Thamarrah (she/her) and Joe (he/him) discuss the role legislators play in protecting us online and how we can stay informed about the policy changes that dictate what tech companies can and cannot do with our data.

Resources mentioned: 5 Easy Steps to Keep Your Kids Safe Online

Joseph Shepherd Miller, Esq. is the Founder of The Washington Center for Technology Policy Inclusion (WashingTech). Through his work at WashingTech, Joe advocates for diversity and inclusion in technology public policymaking and hosts Tech Policy -- a top podcast offering practical and actionable advice to protect yourself and your family from online safety threats.

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Today's episode is brought to you by the Integrated Schools podcast.

Find more As It Should Be at asitshouldbepod.com

Support the show: Join the Collective for only $3 a month

Oct 01, 202227:56

[REPLAY] 05: Building Space for Neurodiversity to Thrive with Vanessa Castañeda Gill (she/her)

In this episode, Co-Founder of Social Cipher, Vanessa Castañeda Gill (she/her) joins the show to discuss how her company is creating space for Neurodivergent youth to thrive through their space pirate-themed social-emotional learning games. Social Cipher is led by a team of Neurodivergent Founders, including Vanessa herself.

Vanessa and Thamarrah (she/her) talk the importance of autistic youth failing safely, challenges faced by neurodivergent people caused by inequity in the workplace and in the startup space as founders, and how we can all support the neurodivergent community.

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Connect with Vanessa Castañeda Gill

Social Cipher Website: socialciphergame.com
@SocialCipher on Twitter
Email: ahoy@socialcipher.com

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Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share the episode with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Sep 14, 202246:01

25: Facing our history to shape our future with Kimberly Latrice Jones (she/her)| Part 2

In part 2 of this 2-part episode, author and activist Kimberly Jones (she/her) joins Thamarrah to discuss taking advantage of the work that’s already being done in your city right now so that we can build thriving communities together. In her book How We Can Win, Kimberly explores the influence America’s history with racial disparity has on our lives today and delivers strategies for how we can effect change while nurturing ourselves in the process. You can buy the audiobook from Libro.fm using code ASITSHOULDBE at checkout and get 2 books for the price of 1.

Aug 31, 202238:10

24: Self-improvement is a revolutionary act with Kimberly Latrice Jones (she/her) | Part 1

Kimberly Jones (she/her) reminds us that the future we have tomorrow is decided by the actions we take today. In this episode Kimberly joins Thamarrah to discuss self-reflection as a community service and how learning from the pursuits and strategies of our ancestors can help guide our path towards justice today.

In 2020, a video of Kimberly speaking on an Atlanta Street went viral after the murder of Ahmaud Aubrey, Breonna Taylor, and George Floyd ignited civil unrest. In just 6 minutes she captivated masses by capturing the economic struggles of Black people in America.

In her book How We Can Win, she explores the influence America’s history with racial disparity has on our lives today and delivers strategies for how we can effect change while nurturing ourselves in the process.

This is part 1 of a 2 part episode.

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Kimberly Jones is an activist, screenwriter, and author. She's co-authored books including the bestselling YA novel I’m Not Dying with You Tonight and Why We Fly.

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Support the show: Buy audiobooks from Libro.fm using code ASITSHOULDBE at checkout to get 2 books for the price of 1.

Aug 17, 202229:46

23: My Culture's Not Your Punchline with Sandhya Jain Patel (she/her)

Culture is so deeply personal that when you see it reflected back at you in a way that’s gimmicky or stereotypical or just downright racist it's impossible to not take that personally. Which is why we expect creators of these productions to actually care enough to try to get it right. Sandhya Jain Patel (she/her) joins the show to discuss what it looks like to get cultural inclusion right.

Today's episode is brought to you by the Reframeables and TwentyTwice podcasts

Find more As It Should Be on asitshouldbepod.com

Aug 03, 202240:39

22: Check the Impact of Stuff You Buy with Fatimah Walee (she/her)

Do you know where the products you own come from? Not where you bought them, but was the person who picked the tomatoes in your tomato paste given fair wages, regular breaks, and adequate water? Was child labor used to create anything you own? It's impossible to answer those questions when companies just won't supply the info. In this episode, Fatimah Walee (she/her), Founder & CEO of Neuterra, joins to help us get some answers. Support Neuterra: Donate as little as $15 to help Neuterra bring supply chain transparency to 5 small and midsize businesses. Trace a product's story from the first kilometer to the last mile. Today's episode is brought to you by the Reframeables podcast.

Jul 20, 202226:41

21: Healing Generational Trauma in America with Resmaa Menakem (he/him) | Pt. 2

This is part 2 of a two-part episode with Resmaa Menakem (he/him). In this segment, we discuss the origin of Resmaa's book The Quaking of America and how we can be cultivating joy and healing in community.

Support Resmaa: His new book The Quaking of America is out now

Support the show: Buy audiobooks from Libro.fm using code ASITSHOULDBE at checkout to get 2 books for the price of 1.

Jul 06, 202227:33

20: Healing Generational Trauma in America with Resmaa Menakem (he/him) | Part 1

Resmaa Menakem (he/him), author of NYT best seller My Grandmother's Hands, joins me in conversation experiencing the overturning of Roe v wade and its effect on Black bodies. We discuss how anti-democratic elements in America are inciting widespread chaos and a collective trauma response in tens of millions of bodies in America. We also talk about our body's response to trauma and go through exercises of somatic practices to mobilize our healing towards the fight for justice.

This is part 1 of a 2 part episode.

Support Resmaa: His new book The Quaking of America is out now

Support the show: Buy audiobooks from Libro.fm using code ASITSHOULDBE at checkout to get 2 books for the price of 1.

Jul 01, 202231:07

Best Of | 01: Decolonizing K12 Education with Susie Berg (she/her)

This is a replay of the very first episode of the As It Should Be podcast recorded in Nov 2020. In this episode, Thamarrah and Susie discuss how the makers of K12 education content are pushing the industry towards more inclusivity by decentering the white experience.
Susie Berg (she/her) is a writer, change agent, and co-conspirator for racial justice. Susie is a Senior Digital Solutions Strategist and Global Diversity and Inclusion Advocate at Pearson, the world’s learning company, an organization committed to helping change lives through learning.
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SUPPORT THE SHOW
Become a Patron for $3 per month at patreon.com/thamarrahjones Send me a coffee at buymeacoffee.com/thamarrahjones Leave a review on Apple podcasts

Jan 05, 202247:14

19: Support Women of Color in Business with Olivia Owens (she/her)

It's well documented women of color founders face both gender & racial inequities when it comes to building and growing their businesses. What I want to know is, what's being done about it? Olivia Owens and iFundWomen of Color are giving WOC founders the capital, coaching, and connections they need to kill the game. We discuss the unique barriers women of color founders face in building sustainable businesses, the best funding resource to kick start your business, and the role corporations play in moving us forward.

SUPPORT THE SHOW

Become a Patron for $3 per month at patreon.com/thamarrahjones Send me a coffee at buymeacoffee.com/thamarrahjones Leave a review on Apple podcasts or rate it on Spotify.

Nov 22, 202129:12

18: Democratize the Workplace with Farzin Farzad (he/him)

In today's episode, I'm talking with Farzin Farzad (he/him) about why hierarchy in the workplace is more harmful than helpful, the strength that lies in reimagining power distribution, and how people around the world are building new models of work that shares power, wealth, and responsibility to all.

Today's Question: How does power affect your work? And is there a such thing as healthy hierarchy?
Submit your response on thamarrahjones.com/18

Become a Patron

If you want to support the show go to patreon.com/thamarrahjones and become a patron for $3 per month.

Nov 10, 202136:18

17: Your Story Matters. Here's Proof.

If you're reading this take this as your reminder that no matter who you are, where you come from, or who the world tells you you are, your story is important and you deserve to share it. In this episode, we meet a person who didn't believe that. But today, we're gonna see if we can work through that a little.

Today's Question: Do you share your story in public? Why or why not?
Submit your response on thamarrahjones.com/17

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If you want to support the show go to patreon.com/thamarrahjones and become a patron for $3 per month. Get episodes 3-5 days early, videos of the interviews, and access to the interview schedule to know what guests are coming up next; submit questions or watch live to call into the show and ask questions!

Oct 06, 202144:04

16: Critique the Stories that Shape Us with F.D Signifier (he/him)

We don't take the critical eye to our film and tv as often and as deeply as is needed. The level of influence that they have on how we not only see ourselves but the stories we believe about other people, requires that we take a step back. In today's episode, Thamarrah is joined by F.D Signifier (he/him). During our conversation I learned so much about Fiq's upbringing and how that shaped him, but we also get into a conversation about how the portrayal of Black men specifically has impacted how WE as a society behave towards them, what we expect from them, and how THEY navigate the world as a result.

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Sep 22, 202148:47

15: Embracing Curiosity and Discovering Each Others Stories with Abhi Nangia (he/him)

What would happen if we were all genuinely interested in wondering about each other and our stories? Today we meet Abhi Nangia (he/him), the Executive Director of Better World Ed, a 501c3 nonprofit on a mission to humanize learning. In this episode, Abhi and Thamarrah (she/her) go on their own journey of exploration and curiosity about each other, how we see (and don't see) people in our communities, and whether curiosity could be a path to equity.

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Sep 08, 202147:31

14: Build Brands Where People Are Seen, Heard, and Understood with Tameka Bazile (she/her)

Thamarrah is joined by Tameka Bazile (she/her) to discuss creating marketing strategies that reflects your audience's stories and building a brand where people feel seen, heard, and understood. Tameka is helping entrepreneurs whose identities have been ignored by the girlboss-chic business coaches of the world. She's giving you the tools to build impactful brands and create conscious content that both empowers and serves your communities.

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Sep 01, 202135:16

13: Accelerate Social Innovation Through Stronger Ecosystems with Anika Horn (she/her)

If you want to support the show go to patreon.com/thamarrahjones and become a patron for $3 per month. Get episodes 3-5 days early, videos of the interviews, and access to the interview schedule to know what guests are coming up next; submit questions or watch live to call into the show and ask questions!

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In today's conversation we dive into the world of ecosystem building. What it is and how ecosystems are giving social innovators around the world the access they need to accelerate their missions. Anika Horn (she/her) is the Founder of Social Venturers. Through her company she is on a mission to support change-makers building purpose-driven careers, organizations and ecosystems without losing themselves.

Aug 25, 202131:26

12: Fight Anti-Blackness in Banking with Asya Bradley (she/her)

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In this episode, Asya Bradley (she/her) & Thamarrah (she/her) discuss predatory practices in the financial system stifling the Black community and how First Blvd Bank has created a bank for Black America to thrive. Asya Bradley is the Co-Founder & COO of First Boulevard: The Unapologetically Black, Digitally Native, NeoBank Building Generational Wealth for Black America. Connect with Asya on LinkedIn or follow @BankBlvd on Twitter.

Aug 18, 202124:31

[BONUS] Coming Soon!

As It Should Be returns with new episodes next week.

Aug 11, 202104:10

11: Create Communities Where The Fullness of Who You Are Matters with Grace Ouma-Cabezas (she/they)

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In this episode, Grace Ouma-Cabezas (she/they) & Thamarrah (she/her) discuss managers helping employees thrive, centering diverse people and experiences in marketing, building a career as a Black woman in corporate, and so much more.

Grace Ouma-Cabezas is the VP of Growth Marketing at TheSkimm and the Founder of FIELD, a storytelling platform for professionals of color to share our real work experiences. Grace is the Co-Host is one of my favorite new podcasts The Diversity Illusion, where 2 NYC professionals (and sometimes their guests) have discussions on being black and brown in the workplace.

Connect with Grace on LinkedIn or follow @OurField on Instagram

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This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Mar 10, 202152:36

10: Innovating Technology to Enable Equity and Justice with River Bunkley

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River Bunkley (he/him) is a Product Specialist at Chan Zuckerberg Initiative and a Co-Founder of The Black Renaissance Group. River has made it his business to build innovative tech solutions to create a more equitable and just world, first prioritizing the development of the Black community which for him starts with reimagining justice.

In today's episode Thamarrah (she/her) and River discuss:

The role of technology in social impact missions
Reimagining justice in the United States
How to find your place in the fight to create an equitable world

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Connect with River Bunkley

Instagram: @River
The Black Renaissance Group: https://www.theblackrenaissancegroup.com/

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This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Feb 26, 202151:39

09: Navigating Culture as an Immigrant with Anya Cherrice (she/her)

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In this episode, Thamarrah (she/her) and Anya Cherrice (she/her) discuss Anya's experience navigating through America as an immigrant, finding community as an adult, and defining American. Anya Cherrice is the CEO of Navigating Culture and the Host of The Homesickness Cure Podcast. Through her company she is on a mission to help Immigrants & First-Gen struggling to navigate two cultures learn how to self-validate, remove self-doubt, and dream bigger.

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Connect with Anya at NavigatingCulture.co or @NavigatingCulture on Instagram

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This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Feb 17, 202133:24

08: Giving Kids the Space to Question in K12 Education with Mike Yates (he/him)

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In this episode, Thamarrah (she/her) and Mike Yates (he/him) discuss how he is reimagining the future of education as one where students love school. Mike Yates is an Educator, Entrepreneur, Public Speaker, and the Senior Managing Director of Network Strategies at the Reinvention Lab by Teach for America.

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Connect with Mike Yates

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mike-yates

Twitter: @JustMikeYates

School-ish Podcast: https://www.yatesmike.com/schoolish-podcast

The Reinvention Lab: www.enduringideas.org

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Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share the episode with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Feb 10, 202141:54

07: Embracing 'Lived Experience' in Inclusion Practices with Patrice M. Palmer (they/them)

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In this episode, Thamarrah (she/her) and Patrice Palmer (they/them) discuss how to deal with gaslighting, creating a culture that validates and embraces lived experience, allyship, and transactional vs transformative inclusion practices. Patrice Palmer is CEO & Principal Consultant @ eROOT Consulting™️, the Director of Social & Cultural Inclusion @ Colorado State University's College of Business, and the Diversity, Equity, Inclusion Specialist @ New Belgium Brewing.

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Connect with Patrice M. Palmer

Email: papalmer5276@gmail.com
Follow Patrice on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/patricempalmer/
Watch their TED Talk: Are you a Man or Woman? ...I'm BLACK

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Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share the episode with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Feb 03, 202153:54

06: Building a Spirit of Equity in Children and in the Workplace with Serian Strauss (she/her)

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In this episode Serian (she/her) and Thamarrah (she/her) discuss how to talk to kids about diversity, white supremacy in the workplace, and facilitating conversations about race that build the spirit of equity in individuals and organizations. Serian is a DEI facilitator, trainer, and personal development coach. Connect with Serian Strauss at serianstrauss.com

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Watch the episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/WMlwuCpp8CU

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Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share the episode with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Jan 20, 202138:28

05: Building Space for Neurodiversity to Thrive with Vanessa Castañeda Gill (she/her)

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Connect with Vanessa Castañeda Gill

Social Cipher Website: socialciphergame.com
Subscribe to their Newsletter
@SocialCipher on Twitter
Email: ahoy@socialcipher.com

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Don't forget to subscribe, leave a review, and share the episode with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Jan 13, 202145:56

04: [BONUS] The Haitians Have Entered the Building | Haitian-American Experience in Corporate & Beyond

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In this very special bonus episode of the podcast Thamarrah is joined by Elizabeth Goeuti, Nagela Dales, and Ralph Desmornes to reminisce on their experiences growing up Haitian-American, building careers in corporate America, finding community, and all of our favorite Haitian things! Join us on this journey of becoming. Bòn fèt endepandans Ayiti.

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Connect with the Guests

Elizabeth Go

Email: Elizbaethgo@weresolvetowin.com
Company: Avinu Consulting
Podcast: We Negotiate to Win

Nagela Dales

SLCo & Agency Website: https://www.slcreative.co
Idea Trust Website: https://www.ideatrust.co
Email: Dales@slcreative.co

Ralph Desmornes

Email: ralph@eclispedigitalagency.com
Social: RDMane
Company: Eclipse Digital Agency

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Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Jan 01, 202101:21:36

Issa Holiday Break

See y'all in 2021. Until then if you want to support the show go to patreon.com/thamarrahjones and become a patron for $3 per month. Get episodes 3-5 days early, videos of the interviews, and access to the interview schedule to know what guests are coming up next; submit questions or watch live to call into the show and ask questions!

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Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Dec 21, 202003:28

03: Curating Experiences That Create Systemic Change with Neal Ludevig (he/him)

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In this episode Neal (he/him) and Thamarrah (she/her) discuss curating spaces that foster conversation to enable systemic change and how to shift your mindset to move from 'problematic savior' to 'ally' to accomplice. Neal Ludevig is a producer, curator, and artist based in Harlem, NY. Neal is the founder of Moon31, a company that creates experiences that bring people together in innovative ways, through the Arts, Entertainment, and Media.

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Connect with Neal Ludevig

Visit Neal's personal website nealludevig.com
Work with Moon31
Watch INSOMNIA, a new dark comedy series about Nikhil - a queer, Indian American going through an identity crisis. Through his adventures, he explores his sexuality, experiences euphoria, deals with racism, and suffers with loneliness - all while trying to get a good night's rest!
Join the waitlist for Snarky Elephant Productions, which is creating content exploring underrepresented human experience

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This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Dec 18, 202052:38

02: Amplifying BIPOC Consumer Experiences with Nagela Dales (she/her)

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Nagela Dales (she/her) is the Founder of SLCo & Agency as well as Idea Trust, the research arm of SLCo & Agency. Through her companies she’s on a mission to make innovation more equitable and to empower the experiences of black & brown consumers. In this episode, Thamarrah and Nagela discuss the biases in the innovation industry, how brands’ research approach undervalues communities of color, and how SLCo is helping to reshape the narrative.

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Connect with Nagela Dales SLCo & Agency Website: https://www.slcreative.co Idea Trust Website: https://www.ideatrust.co Email: Dales@slcreative.co

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Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Dec 09, 202047:36

01: Decolonizing K12 Education with Susie Berg (she/her)

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In this episode, Thamarrah (she/her) and Susie discuss how the makers of K12 education content are pushing the industry towards more inclusivity by decentering the white experience.

Susie Berg (she/her) is a writer, change agent, and co-conspirator for racial justice. Susie is a Senior Digital Solutions Strategist and Global Diversity and Inclusion Advocate at Pearson, the world’s learning company, an organization committed to helping change lives through learning.

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Connect with Susie Berg

Social: @SusieDBerg | Website: Susieberg.ca | Email: bergdiversityconsultants@gmail.com

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This podcast is recorded using Riverside

Dec 02, 202044:31

Welcome to As It Should Be with Thamarrah Jones

As It Should Be with Thamarrah Jones is a mix of solo episodes and conversations with the people remaking the world as it should be. We’ll discuss the role of inclusion, belonging, and equity in facing the challenges shaping our society today. I’ll be talking to changemakers and culture-shakers in every industry from education to entertainment and everything in between to learn how they are using their industry to help build a society where belonging is at the center of everything we do.

“Hope is the belief that destiny will not be written for us, but by us, by the [people] who are not content to settle for the world as it is, who have the courage to remake the world as it should be” - Barack Obama, 44th President of the United States

Enjoying the podcast? Subscribe and Share it with a friend, colleague, or anyone you think might enjoy it too.

Want to connect with Thamarrah? Email her at hello@thamarrahjones.com or follow her LinkedIn https://linkedin.com/in/thamarrahjones

Nov 30, 202001:27