How I Lawyer Podcast with Jonah Perlin

Welcome back to another episode of the How I Lawyer Podcast, where it is my job to interview lawyers about what they do, why they do it, and how they do it well.

Today’s guest is Danielle Garno, who is a Partner and Co-Chair of the Entertainment Practice at Holland & Knight, where she focuses on legal issues faced by fashion, beauty, and luxury brands. Danielle also serves as an adjunct professor at the University of Miami School of Law and has written and lectured extensively on topics relating to fashion law. Prior to joining Holland & Knight, Danielle was a Partner at two big law firms, Cozen O’Connor and Reed Smith.

In this episode, Danielle shares valuable insights about the legal profession including:

💡 How to develop technical skills in your first job after graduating law school [5:06]

💼 How she transitioned from employment law to commercial litigation at her first law firm [7:38]

👠 How advocating for herself led to her career in fashion law [11:44]

📚 How her fashion law practice involves both transactional and litigation legal work [17:11]

🤹‍♂️ How her practice involves a focus on servicing industry clients [21:18]

💻 How to build your brand as a lawyer and the importance of maintaining a great reputation [26:44]

🤝 How she landed her first client in the fashion industry [28:32]

🎤 How she prepared for her first public speaking event and how that helped shape her brand [32:09]

🌐 How to successfully market yourself on LinkedIn [35:27]

👩‍👧‍👧‍👧‍👧 How to balance a robust legal practice while being a mother to four daughters [37:30]

In today’s episode, I speak with Jason Mehta & Natalie Adams who are partners in Foley & Lardner LLP’s Tampa, Florida office where they defend companies and individuals facing government investigation and civil and criminal prosecution. Between the two of them, they have represented clients in healthcare, defense contracting, procurement, higher education, as well as Title IX complaints and in the financial service industries.

Both Jason & Natalie are also former Assistant United States Attorneys who received a number of accolades and awards for their work on behalf of the United States Government. They both started their legal careers as judicial law clerks and at large law firms in DC.

In today’s episode I speak with Peter Orlowicz who is Senior Counsel and an Alternate Designated Agency Ethics Official at the United States Railroad Retirement Board (RRB) speaking in his personal capacity. Peter previously served as a General Attorney for the RRB for 8 years before being promoted to Senior Counsel in 2022. He started his career in government as an attorney advisor at the Social Security Administration. He was honored by the RBB with the Special Act of Service award in 2020, recognizing his significant individual contribution to the Board's efforts. Peter is a graduate of the University of Chicago Law School and Illinois State University.

In our conversation we discuss his path to the law after earning an undergraduate degree in criminal justice, the challenges with getting his first government job during a difficult hiring market (and what he learned from that experience), why taking a first job in government helped him get the government job he has today in a different agency, what the RBB does and his role at that agency, some quirks of being a government train lawyer, why benefits work is not as boring as it might seem on first glance, and more.

In today’s episode I speak with Hilary Gerzhoy who is a Vice Chair of HWG LLP’s Legal Ethics and Malpractice group where she focuses her work on legal ethics, white collar defense, and complex civil litigation.

She has represented lawyers before various disciplinary bodies at both state and federal levels, including the USPTO’s Office of Enrollment and Discipline and the DOJ’s Office of Professional Responsibility. Hilary is deeply involved in the legal community. She is the Vice Chair of the D.C. Bar Rules of Professional Conduct Review Committee, she is on the ABA’s Ethics and Professional Responsibility Committee, and she is on the DC Circuit Admissions and Grievances Committee.

Hilary uses her expertise in legal ethics to teach as an adjunct professor of professional responsibility at Georgetown Law (Hoya Saxa) and she is also a regular author in the legal and popular press on topics related to legal ethics. Hilary earned her JD from the University of California Berkeley School of Law and her BA from the University of Chicago.

In our conversation we discuss her path to the law, the unique nature of legal ethics and malpractice work, what it is like to be a lawyer representing lawyers, her public facing writing and publishing, the importance of her volunteer work serving legal organizations and on bar committees, and more.

In today’s episode I speak with Aliza Shatzman who is the Founder and President of the non-profit Legal Accountability Project based in Washington, DC an organization dedicated to ensuring that law clerks have positive clerkship experiences while extending support and resources to those who do not.

Aliza writes and speaks about judicial accountability, clerkships, and diversity in the courts and has submitted written testimony before Congress and published extensively in both academic publications and in the popular press.

She is a graduate of Williams College where she was a member of the golf team. Prior to Law School she worked on Capitol Hill of three years. She then graduated from Washington University in St. Louis School of Law and following law school, Aliza clerked in the Superior Court of the District of Columbia.

In our conversation we discuss her decision to become a lawyer, her own clerkship experience and why she founded LAP as a result, her mission to improve the judicial clerkship system by making it a safer and more transparent training ground for junior lawyers, the ups and downs of founding a non-profit advocacy group as a young lawyer, and more.

In today’s episode I speak with Josh Scharff who is the General Counsel & Director, Programs at Brady, the Campaign to End Gun Violence.

Before joining Brady more than 5.5 years ago, Joshua served as an associate at Peer, Gan, & Gisler LLP, a Washington, D.C.-based law firm with a nationwide litigation practice and a special focus on effective resolution of labor and employment disputes. Joshua is a graduate of Rutgers (Go Scarlett Knights), the George Washington University Law School(Go Colonials), and holds a Masters in International Studies from John Hopkins School of Advanced Internal Studies (Go Blue Jays). 

In today’s episode I speak with Allison J. Snyder, a long-time construction attorney, arbitrator, and mediator based in Houston, Texas. She has over 35 years of experience as a construction attorney specializing in construction and commercial litigation, arbitration and mediation, construction contract negotiation and drafting and the resolution of various construction claims/work-outs. After 22 years at the Law Firm of Porter Hedges LLP, she went out on her own in May 2023 and will continue to focus on her own ADR practice focused on the construction industry.

Ms. Snyder is a Fellow in the American College of Construction Lawyers and the College of Commercial Arbitrators. She has served as Chair of the State Bar of Texas Construction Law Section and as Chair of the Houston Bar Association ADR Section. She is listed as one of America’s leading lawyers in construction law by Chambers USA.

Allison was recommended by a longtime How I Lawyer listener who wrote the following: Allison is one of the absolute best construction lawyers in Texas, if not nationwide, and is a personal role model of mine. The first thing out of every single person’s mouth when her name comes up is invariably “Allison is so smart. . . Her demeanor is very calm and thoughtful, she comes across so well and authoritative without ever having to appear to push for it — accomplished, aggressive lawyers from all ages and backgrounds seem to just listen when she speaks." With that intro, how could I not interview her.

In today’s episode I am excited to speak with Betsy Philpott who is a Senior Vice President & General Counsel of my hometown Major League baseball team the Washington Nationals.

After starting her career as an associate in BigLaw for 4.5 years, she took a career pivot by starting over as an intern and going back to school for her Masters in Sports Industry Management. She has now been with the Nationals Organization for more than 9 years starting as a Legal Affairs Specialist and working her way up to General Counsel.

In today’s episode I speak with Beth Kurtz. Beth, who is appearing on the show in her personal capacity, currently works as a Trial Attorney in the Civil Rights Division at the Department of Justice in Washington, D.C. Before DOJ, Beth was an Attorney at the American Bar Association at the Center on Children and the Law and before that worked for five years at the Children’s Law Center first as an Equal Justice Works Fellow and later as a Supervising Attorney. Beth started her legal career as a judicial law clerk on the DC Court of Appeals. Before attending law school, Beth worked at American’s United for the Separation of Church and State.

In today’s episode I speak with veteran Aviation Lawyer Mark Fava. Mark started his career as a judicial law clerk and litigation attorney in Charleston, South Carolina but for the past 20+ year he has worked in aviation. In August 2001 mere weeks before 9/11 he went to work for Delta as a Chief Operations Attorney managing passenger litigation and defending the company for all FAA actions. He then worked as a Law Firm Partner focused on litigation and regulatory matters related to airlines, and for the past 13 years has been at Boeing where he has served in a number of different legal and executive roles.

Hello & Welcome Back! In today’s very special panel opinion episode, I am excited to welcome four FUTURE lawyers to the podcast to talk about their paths to law school, their lives as Georgetown Law students, and their tips for success. I think this episode is a great starting place if you think you might want to go to law school. It is also a great listen for those who haven't been in law school in a little while.

My guests are Noah Curtiss, Naman Gupta, Jon-Mark Overvold, and Alexis Marvel. I couldn't be more grateful to them for sharing their time and their personal stories. On the episode we discuss their different paths to the profession, their motivations to attend law school, what a day in the life of a law student is like and their tips & tricks for success.

I am lucky enough to work with law students everyday but recording this episode was really powerful for me. It is a reminder that the future of our profession is very bright.

One final note. Our four panelists today were selected because of their support of the Georgetown Law Equal Justice Foundation auction, an entirely student-run program that helps provides funding for Georgetown Law students working in unpaid summer internships within public interest organizations in Washington, D.C., across the nation, and around the world. I couldn't be more pleased to support EJF with this episode.

In today's episode I speak with Entertainment Lawyer Paul Sarker who was recently named a Shareholder at Greenberg Traurig’s New York Office. Paul represents clients in mergers and acquisitions, television affiliation and retransmission consent agreements, content licensing, business affairs, television production, music, copyright, recording agreements, sponsorships, rights acquisitions, guild, and union matters. Before joining Greenberg Traurig, Paul worked in-house at Disney & Marvel as well as at other law firms in the Entertainment space. In addition, Paul is the co-host of Better Call Paul, a podcast that discusses the business and legal side behind the scenes of Hollywood, sports, and entertainment.

In our conversation we discuss Paul's path to law, his decision to take an in-house job at Marvel out of school, his first day on the job, the differences between BigLaw and in-house practice, skills for junior lawyers, the power of visual communication, his podcast, and more.

In honor of Well-being Week in Law I speak with Jordana Alter Confino. Jordana plays many different roles but what they all share is a focus on the skills, well-being, empowerment, mental health, and growth of lawyers & law students. She is the Assistant Dean of Professionalism at Fordham Law where she oversees all aspects of the Professionalism Office’s work including the Law School’s wellness, professionalism, and peer mentorship offerings. Jordana also serves as an Adjunct Professor of Law, teaching Positive Lawyering and Peer Mentoring & Leadership. She was voted Fordham Law Adjunct Professor of the Year in 2021. She also has her own consulting and coaching business where she works with individuals and groups on topics related to building connections, living your values, dealign with perfectionism by cultivating a growth mindset, and using positive psychology to boost well-being, resilience, performance, and happiness. She serves as a leader of number of academic and professional organizations focused on balance and attorney well-being. Prior to joining Fordham, Jordana served as the Assistant Director of Academic Counseling, Acting Clerkship Advisor, and a Lecturer in Law at Columbia Law and before that started her career as a law clerk to judges on the Second Circuit Court of Appeals and the Southern District of New York. She is a graduate of Yale College and Yale Law School (Go Bulldogs) and she holds a certification in applied Positive Psychology from the New York Open Center.

In our conversation we discuss her personal challenges and how they led her current career, her decision to study and then teach positive psychology to law students and lawyers, her techniques to help lawyers deeper and more fulfilling professional and personal lives, perfectionism in our profession, the importance of identifying and living your values, and more.

You can learn more about Jordana and her work at the following links:

In today’s episode I speak with Priya Coffey who is a Partner at Jackson Walker in Houston, Texas where she practices Real Estate law. Specifically, Priya assists clients with complex commercial real estate transactions, including the representation of buyers and sellers in the acquisition and disposition of raw land, office buildings and retail centers, and the representation of landlords and tenants in commercial office building leases and retail leases. Priya’s experience extends to advising her clients on land use matters, City of Houston ordinances and other governmental compliance related matters. She also represents both buyers and sellers in the acquisition and disposition of high-end residential property.

Priya is active in a number of legal and community organizations including Covenant House, Executive Sleep Out Committee, Board of Directors of Recipe for Success, and the University of Chicago’s Houston Regional Council. She is also a member of the South Asian Bar Association of Houston, and The Junior League of Houston, Inc. and the Executive Women’s Partnership in Houston.

Priya is a graduate of the University of Chicago (Go Maroons) and holds a Masters in Public Policy from the London School of Economics, and a JD from Texas Tech University School of Law (Go Red Raiders).

In our conversation we discuss her decision to become a lawyer, how a clerkship changed her professional life even as a transactional lawyer, the unique parts (and not so unique parts) of real estate law, some of the suprising parts of her career, the super power of taking on opportunities to learn new things, where the practice of real estate law is going in the years to come, and more.

In today’s episode I speak with Donald Sherman who is a government ethics and oversight lawyer who is currently the Senior Vice President & Chief Counsel at Citizens for Responsibility and Ethics in Washington, CREW (where, full disclosure, he works with my wife). In addition to his non-profit litigation experience at CREW, Donald has worked in all three branches of government. He served for a number of years as Senior Counsel to Ranking Member Senator Claire McCaskill on the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee. Before that he was Chief of Staff and Senior Counsel for Oversight and Investigations in the Office of General Counsel at the U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD). And before that he worked for Rep. Elijah Cummings, then-Ranking Member of the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform including as Chief Oversight Counsel. He started his legal career as a law clerk Honorable Neil E. Kravitz of the District of Columbia Superior Court and worked in private practice at Crowell & Morning. Donald is a proud graduate of both Georgetown University and Georgetown Law (Go Hoyas).

In our conversation we discuss his decision to become a lawyer in elementary school, how crashing a wedding helped him get his first job in government oversight, the nuts and bolts of being an oversight and ethics lawyer on Capitol Hill and in the non-profit space, how the Hill and advocacy organizations interact when it comes to government oversight work, developing the skills of factual development and investigations, what constitutes success when advocating for major political change, the ways to transition from the private to the public sector, the superpower of being an effective generalist, and the role that people/kindness/relationships play in the life and career of a lawyer.

In today’s episode I am excited to speak with Dan Cotter. Dan is currently an attorney at Howard & Howard in Chicago where he represents businesses at many different stages in corporate and transactional matters. He has a particular emphasis on privacy and cybersecurity law. But over the course of his 25-plus years as a lawyer, Dan has had a varied and in his words "eclectic" practice having practiced in different areas and different settings including but not limited to litigation, in-house counsel, outside general counsel, and working on behalf of both for profit and non-profit entities. 

In today’s episode I am excited to speak with Brian Farkas. Brian is an Associate at Arent Fox Schiff in New York City where he handles complex commercial disputes in federal and state courts as well as in arbitrations and mediation proceedings. Before joining that firm Brian served as a law clerk to Judge Robert W. Lehrburger of the US District Court of SDNY and worked for six years at a midsize litigation firm in New York. He is deeply committed to teaching and training the next generation of lawyers. I am not sure how he has time for it all but he serves as an adjunct professor at Cardozo Law where he teaches arbitration and dispute resolution having won the Best Adjunct Professor Award several times as well as teaching mediation and negotiation at CUNY and Brooklyn Law. He is also an active member of the New York City Bar Association, where he serves on the Board of Directors and chairs the City Bar’s New Lawyer Institute, which offers career development programming and mentoring for law students and recent graduates.

He’s been named a Rising Star in Business Litigation for 8 years and He’s also active in the ABA and is a regular contributor to law reviews and legal trade publications. He is a graduate of Vassar where he currently serves on the Board of Trustees and Cardozo Law.

In our conversation we discuss his path from college journalist and student bar leader to lawyer, the real value of what a legal education provides, dealing with imposter syndrome as a junior lawyer (getting comfortable with being uncomfortable), his decision to be a mid-career judicial law clerk, not ignoring the downside risk of not making a change when assessing a new opportunity, the differences and similarities between litigation, mediation, and arbitration practices, why the best lawyers know how to read a room, learning how to be a "middle voice," rethinking of networking as friendship building, and more.

🙏 Thanks to Episode Sponsors

In today’s special Panel Opinion episode of How I Lawyer produced with The Appellate Project I am excited to welcome four appellate lawyers who share their paths to becoming appellate lawyers and the tools they have learned for success along the way. 

I am excited to partner with the Appellate Project on this episode. TAP is a non-profit dedicated to diversifying the appellate bar and empowering law students of color to thrive in the appellate field. I previously spoke to TAP's Executive Director and Founder Juvaria Khan on Episode #10!

The episode features:

• Cristina Najarro (Deputy State Public Defender at  the Office of the State Public Defender in Oakland, California) 
• Mahogane Reed (Appellate Attorney at the U. S. Department of Justice in Washington, D.C.)
• Juan Perla (Partner, Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle LLP in New York, NY)
• Ian Courts (Assistant District Attorney-Appeals Unit in Philadelphia, PA)

In today’s episode I am excited to speak with my friend Matt Schwartz. Matt is a transactional partner and law firm leader at the international law firm DLA Piper where he serves as Chair of the US Finance Practice and the Head of Venture & Growth Lending. He has been at DLA for more than 20 years since graduating from Harvard Law School (Go Crimson) and the George Washington University (Go Colonials). At DLA and in the broader legal community, Matt is deeply committed to mentorship. He is a co-founder of and leader in the national non-profit Legal Mentor Network where he has personally mentored dozens of junior lawyers and helped facilitate hundreds of mentor-mentee partnership. He is also active in charitable efforts in the San Diego community and is perhaps most known as a baseball coach and #lawdad. 

In our conversation we discuss his path to transactional work, the lifecycle of a deal, the importance of learning what you want to do by getting experiences, mentoring pest practices, the network effects of being a mentor, removing the shame from making mistakes, and the upcoming DLA Piper/Legal Mentor Bootcamp (more information below).

***Want to learn more about transactional law practice? (It is free and available to anyone).***

DLA Piper & non-profit Legal Mentor Network are hosting a four-part introduction to fundamentals and best practices for new lawyers working in a transactional practice. Each session will be eligible for 90 minutes of CLE credit and the Legal Mentor Network will provide a certificate of completion for anyone who attends all four sessions. DLA Piper has underwritten the cost of the entire program which is free to any law students or young lawyers who would benefit from the content. 

Session Dates

Session 1: Friday, February 17
Session 2: Friday, March 3
Session 3: Friday, March 17
Session 4: Friday, March 31

You must attend all four sessions to receive the LMN certificate of completion.

All session times

12:00 pm – 1:30 pm PT
2:00 pm – 3:30 pm CT
3:00 pm – 4:30 pm ET

In today's episode I speak with Freelance Attorney Michelle K. Camp. Michelle is an experienced litigator who has handled all aspects of litigation from pre-litigation to drafting pleadings and motions, conducting discovery, and assisting with trials and appeals in both state and federal court. She began her career and worked for nearly seven years at Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher, LLP, where she focused on securities litigation and mass tort litigation. In her freelance work over the past 6 years since leaving BigLaw, she has assisted clients with a variety of business litigation, arbitration, appeals, and labor & employment projects on a freelance basis. Michelle is a proud first-gen graduate of Portland State and Pepperdine Law (from which she graduated summa cum laude). She is also a proud military spouse and mom to four young children.

In our conversation we discuss Michelle's path to law school, finding success as a first-gen student in law school, getting a position in BigLaw, her decision to move to freelance work, the different kinds of freelance work lawyers can do (including working on substantive motions and legal writing), and the various personal and professional benefits she has found in the freelance path. 

💯 Welcome to Episode #100 of the How I Lawyer Podcast! 💯

I started the podcast in January 2021 to help junior lawyers, law students, and the legal community learn from the stories of lawyers from across the profession about what they do, why they do it, and how they do it well. 100 episodes later the podcast has grown beyond my wildest dreams. 

If you've enjoyed the show I hope you'll leave a review and rating and share the podcast with friends, colleagues, or on social media. 

---

In today's episode I speak with Kristen Vander-Plas LaFreniere who founded her own #TeenyLaw Firm in her hometown of Lubbock, Texas where she works with her husband David LaFreniere and their PAWclerk Copper. Kristen practices in a number of different areas including: business counseling, civil litigation, probate, and civil appeals. She is a member of the State Bar of Texas and the Lubbock Area Bar Association and is admitted to practice in all Texas courts, the Supreme Court of the United States, the Federal Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit, along with various federal district courts. Kristen is a leader in her community and has held various positions of leadership throughout the Lubbock area including teaching courses in business law to college students and coaching moot court teams. After Kristen completed a summer internship with then-Justice Don Willett at the Supreme Court of Texas (now Judge Willett on the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Fifth Circuit), Justice Willett asked her back to be his post-graduate law clerk and briefing attorney for the 2016-17 court term. She then practiced at a medium-sized law firm before founding her own firm. She is active on Twitter at www.twitter.com/KVPTexas.

In our conversation we discuss Kristen's path to the law from home school to completing multiple majors and minors in college, the power of learning how to learn, her experiences at the Texas Supreme Court (including participating in conference), the role of moot court in her legal education, her decision to found her own "Teeny" law firm (and how others can do the same), the balance between picking areas of practice and being an expert, how being the daughter of a Pastor taught her to be a better at client service, how to network with less stress, the counterintuitive goal of making yourself unnecessary to your clients, balancing work and life as a law firm founder working from home, and so much more. 

In today's episode I speak with Jenni Katzman who is a government & policy lawyer with experience in all three branches of government, several political campaigns, and non-profit advocacy organizations. Currently, she is the General Counsel and Chief of Domestic Policy for Senator Ron Wyden (D-Or). Before working on Capitol Hill, Jenni worked as a Director of Policy Development and Programming at the American Constitution Society and before that in the Executive Branch at the White House, DOJ, and the Department of Education, and as a Voter Protection Counsel for the Obama for America Campaign. Prior to her career in policy, she worked in private practice at two different law firms and served as a law clerk to a federal judge. She is a graduate of Duke and Cornell Law.

In our conversation we discuss her path to the law, her experience clerking after several years in private practice, the transition from litigation to policy work, the roles that lawyers play on Capitol Hill and in the Executive Branch, what its like to be a lawyer in a fast-paced presidential campaign, the power of not just saying no but also trying to come up with creative solutions to get to yes, why diversity is so important on Capitol Hill and throughout the government, what distinguishes policy work from other areas of legal practice, and the importance of speaking up as a junior lawyer. 

In today’s special episode of How I Lawyer, Panel Opinion I am excited to speak with two law firm partners on how to succeed as a junior associates at a law firm with Sean Marotta and Michelle Strowhiro.  

Michelle is an employment partner and M&A transaction advisor in McDermott’s LA and Orange County Offices. She leads McDermott’s Transactions and Executive Contracts Employment Subgroup and co-leads McDermott’s COVID-19 Employment Task Force.  Michelle was recently named an a Trailblazer by American Lawyer and a Labor & Employment Star by Benchmark Litigation. She is also active in mentoring junior lawyers both formally and informally within her firm and on social media.  

Sean Marotta is an Appellate Litigation Partner at Hogan Lovells DC office. Sean has worked on cases and appeals in many substantive areas of law but is particularly experienced in civil-procedure, automotive, energy, and administrative appeals. Sean has received a number of awards and recognitions for his work including as being selected as a DC Rising Star by the National Law Journal. Like Michelle, Sean is deeply dedicated to advancing the profession and mentoring junior lawyers. He is active or should I say prolific on social media where he regularly offers advice for junior lawyers.  

In today’s special episode recorded LIVE at ClioCon I spoke with Kevin Buckley of the Torrey Pines Law Group. Kevin is an accomplished international patent attorney & executive. He founded Torrey Pines Law Group in 2013 to help his clients bring lifesaving, enduring, and commercially valuable technologies to market after previously working in Big Law. He recently earned the Clio Reisman Award for Best Growth Story for his work and the work of his law firm during the Covid 19 pandemic. Kevin is a graduate of US San Diego where he studied Biochemistry and the University of Pittsburg School of Law.   In our conversation we discuss the importance of finding what you are good at, what patent attorneys do (and how that has changed through his career), the importance of connecting business/law/science especially in today’s historical moment, and why they best skill to learn is how to constantly learn from the smart people around you. 

In today’s episode I speak with Legal Technologist and Clio Founder & CEO Jack Newton. Although not a lawyer himself, Jack is a technologist and entrepreneur who has long been at the forefront of cloud-based legal technology who is recognized as one of the profession’s foremost experts on security, ethics, and privacy issues related to lawyers’ use of cloud computing.  He is also the author of the Client-Centered Law Firm, a bestselling book, dedicated to helping law firms thrive in an experience-driven era. He holds a BS and MS in Computer Science from the University of Alberta (Go Golden Bears and Pandas).  In the conversation we discuss the story of how he founded a legal technology company despite not being a lawyer, the importance of learning about the business of law, the reasons why lawyers tend to be slow to change and the value of being OK with rejecting the status quo, finding the latent legal markets of today and tomorrow, reframing clients as customers, and more. 

Hello & Welcome Back! In today’s special episode recorded at ClioCon I spoke with Mark Palmer. He is the Chief Counsel at 2Civility, the Illinois Supreme Court Commission on Professionalism where he works to facilitate the promotion of professionalism, civility, and integrity among lawyers and judges in Illinois. He is also an Adjunct Professor at the University of Illinois College of Law. Prior to his work with the Commission, he was a trial attorney in Champaign and before law school was a police officer for the Champaign Police Department. He is a graduate of the University Illinois and the University of Illinois Chicago School of Law.

Hello & Welcome Back! In today’s special episode recorded LIVE at ClioCon I spoke with family lawyer Angela Lennon. Angela is a Partner at the Omaha Law Firm Koenig Dunne where she focuses her practice on collaborative divorce. Angela is active in legal and local business organization and has won a number of awards for her work. She recently won Clio’s Reisman Award for creating Untie Online, Nebraska’s affordable divorce service that uses to technology and step-by-step guidance, personalized legal documents, and support powered by the Koenig|Dunne legal team to reimagine what divorce support looks like. She is a graduate of Vassar College (Go Brewers) and Creighton School of Law (Go Bluejays). 

In our conversation we discuss her path from receptionist at her law firm to partner, the online program she created to provide limited-scope divorce support, a day-in-the-life of a family lawyer, the importance of listening as a divorce lawyer, and more.

In this mini-episode of How I Lawyer recorded live at ClioCon in Nashville, I spoke with Neal Katyal who is a partner at Hogan Lovells and the former Solicitor General of the United States. Most importantly for my purposes, he also was my criminal law professor when I was a student at Georgetown Law. In our brief chat, we discussed the importance of speaking to your audience as a lawyer and his takes on what law schools can do better to train the next generation of lawyers. 

In today’s special, mini-episode recorded LIVE at ClioCon I spoke with Michigan Criminal Defense lawyer Mary Chartier. Mary has successfully defended clients in numerous federal and state trial courts and on appeal at the Michigan Supreme Court. Mary’s practice is not limited to one single area of criminal law but instead she has developed a reputation as an expert defense attorney no matter how novel the case is. She even takes on “doggy death row” cases pro bono representing dogs who have been ordered to be euthanized. She and her firm recently won Clio’s Reisman award for its wrongful conviction work.

In our conversation we discuss her path to criminal defense law despite thinking she wanted to open a restaurant, the ways in which being a criminal defense lawyer is different from but even more exciting than you might see on TV, the ways in which female lawyers are changing and improving our profession, how she thinks about arguing hard and novel cases, the importance of pro bono to her practice, the kinds of skills you can build as a young lawyer to become a criminal defense lawyer. 

In today’s episode I speak with Joshua Lenon who is the Lawyer in Residence and Data Protection Officer at major legal software company Clio. Joshua has served in this role at Clio for the past decade and before that he worked at Thomson-Reuters. I interviewed Josh just a few days before I attended ClioCon—a major legal technology convention where I interviewed legal tech luminaries (more interviews from ClioCon to come soon). 

In today's episode I speak with Eli Albrecht who is an Associate at Gibson Dunn’s Washington D.C. office where he is a member of the corporate practice with a focus on private equity and mergers and acquisitions. 

In addition to his day job, Eli writes about his own path in the legal profession primarily on LinkedIn where, in his words, he focuses on balancing life as a private equity lawyer, husband, and LawDad in a way that is "fully integrated." He shares openly about finding the balance between being a fully engaged dad and working in a highly demanding legal practice and how he practices his faith while also practicing law.

In our conversation we discuss his path to the law, a day in the life of a corporate M&A lawyer in a big international law firm, the skills that help corporate lawyers stand out (and how to acquire those skills after law school), why M&A law is like wedding planning, how he navigates being a Sabbath-observant Jew in an always-on profession, the importance of enjoying the stage you are at, rejuvenating during the slow times so you are ready in the fast times, his personal approach (and journey) to being an effective lawyer while also being a engaged father, and more.

In today’s episode I am excited to speak with Housing Rights Attorney Sateesh Nori. Sateesh went from pursuing human rights law as a career to working in housing court in Brooklyn. He spent more than twenty years as a legal services attorney at The Legal Aid Society of New York City (including most recently as Attorney in Charge of the Queens Neighborhood Office) and Bedford Stuyvesant Community Legal Services. In those two decades Sateesh became a manager, started teaching as a clinical adjunct at NYU, wrote a book, and even ran for judge. Born in India, Sateesh was the first South Asian attorney to direct a borough-wide office of a legal services organization in New York City. This past spring he took a step back from his front lines representation in housing court to join JustFix, a tech company focused on providing access to justice in the housing space.

In our conversation we discuss his somewhat circuitous path to Housing Rights Attorney (and why he almost never practiced as an attorney at all), the unique nature of housing court, managing a significant and court-intensive docket, working in a broken system, his transition to legal tech, the use of technology as a path to greater access to justice, and more. 

In today’s episode, I speak with Megan Cacace who is a civil rights lawyer and anti-discrimination advocate focused on the intersection of civil rights and technology. She currently serves as the Director of Anti-Discrimination & Equity Programs at Airbnb. Previously she worked as a civil rights lawyer at the law firm of Relman Colfax for almost 14 years. In that role, in addition to plaintiff-side civil rights litigation, she worked on civil rights audits including Facebook’s 2020 Audit. Before joining Relman Colfax, she was a Fellow at the Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights. She started her career as a law clerk to Judge Morris Lasker of the United States District Court for the District of Massachusetts.  In our conversation we discuss her path to civil rights law, her work first as a litigator and now as an in-house anti-discrimination and equity programs leader, the importance of showing demonstrated interested in getting a public interest job, civil rights audit and advising on civil rights best practices, how to prepare for an unknown future when planning a legal career, the importance of passion in your professional life, and more. 

In today's episode I speak with M.C. Sungaila who is an Orange County-based shareholder and leader of the appellate practice at Buchalter. M.C. has briefed and argued appeals in a number of different practice areas at the California Supreme Court and throughout the country. She has won numerous awards including California Lawyer of the Year from California Lawyer Magazine and the Ellis Island Medal of Honor. In addition to her practice, M.C. is active in pro bono and professional organizations. Among them, she is the co-chair of the Appellate Practice Committee for the ABA & is active in the National Association of Women Lawyers. She writes and speaks in popular and trade publications and has taught appellate law as an adjunct professor at Loyola Law School for a number of years. She is also the host of the absolutely fabulous podcast, the Portia Project, which interviews women on their path to the bench, the bar, and beyond. To quote Hamilton (sort of), the woman is non-stop!

In today's episode I speak with Paresh Patel who is currently the Chief of Appeals at the Office of the Federal Defender for the District of Maryland where he has worked for the past 18 years. In this role he represents clients on post conviction matters including direct appeal and federal habeas. He also assists trial attorneys on complex legal issues that arise in their cases.

In our conversation we discuss his path to becoming a public defender, the unique role of an appellate lawyer in the federal criminal system, the ways criminal law and criminal prosecutors have changed over the past two decades and how those changes have affected his role, how he drafts briefs and prepares for oral argument, the process for becoming a public defender, the impact of storytelling in his writing, the strategy of balancing the arguments of individual clients and other similarly situated criminal defendants, and the power of on the job learning as a young lawyer.

In today’s episode I speak with my dear friend Micah Gibson who is an International Tax Director at Big 4 accounting firm PWC based in Washington, D.C. In this role, Micah helps global businesses structure their tax arrangements to support their strategic goals. He joined PWC more than 8 years ago after completing his JD and LLM in Tax from Georgetown Law. During his time at Georgetown he was an extern for Judge Albert G. Lauber on the United States Tax Court. 

In our conversation we talk about what makes tax such a unique area of practice, why being a tax lawyer is exciting because it requires creativity, the difference between working for a law firm and an accounting firm, how he works with clients both internal and external, the way he stays up-to-date in such a fast-changing area of law by digesting the never-ending stream of information in effective ways, the importance of specialization in his area of practice but also the value of having a network who can help you in other areas, the benefit of embracing "hard things," the importance of working with great people, the experience and value of being on the ground during a change in the law, and more.

If you enjoy this episode, please make sure to sign up for future episodes at www.howilawyer.com or to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.

In today’s episode I speak with Alé Dalton who is an associate at Bradley LLP’s Nashville Office. Her practice focuses on healthcare transactional work where she provides counsel during mergers and acquisitions, as well as guiding clients through issues that arise from the complex nature of operating in a highly regulated industry. She also advises clients in matters involving clinical research and telemedicine. Beyond her healthcare industry work she is committed to doing pro bono and helping to meet the legal service gaps in the state by staffing community legal clinics. In addition to being active in Bradley’s pro bono program she serves as vice chair of the firm's Lawyers of Color Resource Group and as a liaison for the firm’s Women’s Initiative. Alé is a first-generation college student, lawyer, and American with a keen interest in mentoring other first gen students. She is a 2016 graduate of the University of Tennessee College of Law and Lipscomb University. 

In our conversation we talk about her path to the profession as a first generation American, college, and law student (who early on had a dream to become a surgeon); the ways that the internet and social media can support more junior lawyers in building and expanding their networks; the day-to-day life of a lawyer who helps clients buy and sell hospitals and healthcare facilities; how to stand out as a junior associate; and how to find your niche and grow during the first few years of law practice.

If you enjoy this episode, please make sure to sign up for future episodes at www.howilawyer.com or to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.

In today’s episode I speak with Christine E. Webber who is a leading plaintiff-side class-action civil rights & employment attorney. Christine is a Partner and Co-Chair of the Civil Rights & Employment practice group at Cohen Milstein. In this role, she represents victims of discrimination and wage and hour violations in class and collective actions. She has represented clients in some of the largest, groundbreaking discrimination and Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) class and collective actions in the United States. She has been recognized with numerous of awards for her work and has served as a leader in a number of employment-law related organizations. Christine started her career as a law clerk to Judge Will on the United States District Court for the Northern District of Illinois and as a Fellow at the Lawyer's Committee for Civil Rights.

In our conversation we discuss her path to law which began by lobbying for more rights for girls in her 3rd-grade classroom, the differences between changing the law through policy and through litigation, the importance of seeing both the big picture and the narrow details in plaintiff-side class action work, how she prepares for depositions (in her words, it is like putting a puzzle together without having the picture on the box) and the importance of both planning and flexibility in that process, why she loves working with statistical experts who are so important to her cases, how "winning" differs as a plaintiff-side class action lawyer, the skills that make newer lawyers stand out in her experience (research, details, preparation), why her decision to take a risk early on and jump at an uncertain opportunity made the rest of her career possible, and the various paths to the kind of work that she does.

If you enjoy this episode, please make sure to sign up for future episodes at www.howilawyer.com or to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.

In today’s episode I speak with civil rights and criminal defense lawyer Kobie Flowers, who represents the wrongly accused and the wrongly convicted. He is a Partner at Brown, Goldstein & Levy in Washington, D.C. 

Kobie is a trial lawyer’s trial lawyer. He started his career in the Attorney General’s Honors Program where he worked as civil rights prosecutor at the United States Department of Justice with a focus on prosecution of police brutality. After he completed his time at DOJ, Kobie worked as an Assistant Federal Defender in Baltimore where he represented clients in a number of different substantive areas of criminal law. His practice has given him chances to litigate in state and federal courts throughout the country as well internationally at the military commission in Guantanamo Bay. He is active in the legal community including service on the boards of the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers and the Mid-Atlantic Innocence Project. He’s taught trial skills and trial advocacy across the country in both professional and academic settings. Kobie is a graduate of Stanford University and Georgetown Law. Before attending law school he served in Peace Corps.

In our discussion we discuss his path to law school after the summer of 1992 and its similarities to the summer of 2020; how starting in DOJ as a civil rights prosecutor made him a better criminal defense lawyer; the importance of learning from hard cases and why the raw number of cases you've tried is less important than how difficult they were; life as a federal defender and later criminal defense lawyer; the unique experience of the grand jury; the value of having a case theory from the very beginning of your case all the way through trial; the power of watching and learning from experienced lawyers as well as more junior lawyers (and even non-lawyers); the critical skill of storytelling as it relates to trying criminal cases; and the societal problems he sees with the disappearance of the criminal jury trial. 

If you enjoy this episode, please make sure to sign up for future episodes at www.howilawyer.com or to subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.